Video Series: Communal Culture Episode 2: Honor and Shame

⬤Marcia: Earlier this year, a 13 year old girl in Iran eloped with an older man against her father’s wishes. He had authorities bring her home, and the father took things into his own hands. She was beheaded with a sickle by her father as she slept.

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⬤Brian: Shalom! Welcome to Bridges to the Bible! I’m Brian Johnson.

⬤Marcia: And I’m Marcia Johnson.

⬤Brian: How could a father do this to his own daughter? What was he thinking?

⬤Marcia: Well, the family reported that this was an “honor killing” where the person killed is accused of bringing shame to their family or their village. They believe that the killing restores lost honor.

⬤Brian: This is the second part in the series on community within Biblical culture. Visit BridgesToTheBible.com where you can download the episode guide to this episode, where you can find study notes to follow along, discussion questions and more. Last week we looked at eastern versus western, of how the eastern context is much more community focused versus western is more individual. And it’s not one or the other: community’s important in the west, and it’s not that individuals don’t exist in the east. But there’s a spread, a continuum that we have less desire for community than they do; They have more of a desire for community, that sort of thing. Today we’re going to look at one of the aspects that we mentioned last week, and that’s the topic of honor/shame culture.

⬤Marcia: This is a really foreign concept for us. We tend to look at things as right or wrong, where they view things in light of whether it results in honor or shame.

⬤Brian: Right. It’s not that we don’t care to avoid shame; we want to avoid shame, but it doesn’t really hint at the extreme that they do. And it’s not to say that the Israelites permitted honor killings; that’s not the idea that we’re saying at all, but rather that the honor/shame concept that they had, that’s around today, is very much closely linked.

⬤Marcia: Brian, when I think of the word “honor”, I think of people with a bumper sticker that says, “Proud parent of an Honor Roll student!” Is this what we mean by a society focused on honor?

⬤Brian: No, it’s completely different than that. People in individualistic societies like ours, we just expect people’s actions to be driven by a right and wrong. “Let your conscience be your guide” is what we would say. You should follow the rules and the laws.

⬤Marcia: Well, this makes total sense to us, so it’s really hard to understand this opposite view. So our goals today in understanding this eastern honor/shame culture is: 1) so we can better understand these Biblical stories which operate under this perspective, and 2) that we can gather some insights in how honor/shame affects us, including how Jesus took our shame.

⬤Brian: We’re going to start by looking at some modern examples, and then go to some Biblical examples. And we need to understand that in honor/shame like the opening story that this is a key part of what is driving eastern cultures. Their main goal is to avoid shame and gain honor. And this can be in the context of within their family and especially within their community. For an easterner to be branded as a “fool” is synonymous with being shamed.

⬤Marcia: We westerners decide how we’re going to act and live based on how each one of us feels, well, this is “right”. Or otherwise we’re like: can’t do that because otherwise it’s going to make me feel guilty. But an easterner wants instead to meet the expectation of the authorities that set the rules, like for their own community standards. Westerners are more guided by this internal voice; where easterners, it’s more by the opinions of others. So like if an easterner acts in a way that brings shame to their community, they might end up being ostracized or even worse. We westerners might not even think about consequences to our behavior, unless it’s something we get in trouble with the law.

⬤Brian: Yeah, for them they’ve got this idea of an honor rating essentially that would be sort of an equivalent to a credit rating in our society, that if I want to get a new mortgage, I better have a good credit rating; or the better, the easier it’s going to be. For them a better honor rating is going to propel them forward within society much more, and a low honor rating could really hold them back, and people might distance themselves from them. To try to draw some sort of analogy to us, I think of websites, like for instance, eBay, where all the sellers have got a rating. And if it’s a good rating people are more likely to want to buy from you because you’ve demonstrated being reliable, versus if someone’s got a really low rating, you might hesitate to want to buy from them because what you purchase you might not get.

⬤Marcia: Can you give me an example in our world of honor and shame?

⬤Brian: Well, Nabeel Kurdeshi, in his book Seeking Allah, Finding Jesus, tells kind of a more trivial example, but still a good example nonetheless. He talked about when he was growing up (I think he was a teenager), and he was going to a fast food restaurant, and one of the common things that he and his friends did was they would order water, because that was free, but then they’d go over to the fountain drink and fill it up and not pay for it. Well, this went on for some time, and then suddenly one day, an employee caught him doing it and stomped on over and said in front of his friends and in front of everyone in the restaurant, “Hey, you didn’t pay for that! You paid just for water!” Now, think about that: how does he feel as an easterner at this point?

⬤Marcia: Oh, just full of shame. He was shamed in front of his friends and, sounds like, the entire restaurant. So what’d he do?

⬤Brian: So then suddenly he goes, “No I didn’t!” and he switches over to the water and fills it up even though there was a dark liquid already in the bottom of his cup.

⬤Marcia: Why’d he do that?

⬤Brian: He’s trying to regain some of his honor; he’s trying to save face.

⬤Marcia: So hopefully these modern examples can help us understand this concept in Biblical culture. Let’s look at a few Bible verses  — there’s dozens of them that mention honor or shame — but let’s just look for a few

⬤Brian: Okay sounds good. So I think I’ll start by looking at a few that talk about “shame”. So first of all, in Psalm 25:3, it says, “No one who hopes in you will ever be put to shame, but shame will come to those who are treacherous without cause.” Or in Jeremiah 17:13: “LORD you are the hope of Israel, all who forsake you will be put to shame, those who turn away from you will be written in the dust because they have forsaken the LORD the spring of living water.” And 1 Corinthians 6:5: “I say this to shame you. Is it possible there is nobody among you wise enough to judge as a dispute between believers?”

⬤Marcia: Alright, so now listen for the word “honor” in these verses. Exodus 20:12: “Honor your father and mother, so that you may live long in the land the LORD your God is giving you.” Esther 3:2: “All the royal officials at the king’s gate knelt down and paid honor to Haman, for the king had commanded this concerning him, but Mordecai would not kneel down or pay him honor.” And in Romans 12:10: “Be devoted to one another in brotherly love. Honor one another above yourselves.”

⬤Brian: So those are some examples of the words “honor” and “shame” being used, but even if those words aren’t used specifically, the theme of honor/shame is flowing throughout the Biblical narrative. So let’s look at a few examples, starting with David.

⬤Marcia: Let’s look at during the time when David was fleeing from Saul. He and his men had been protecting the shepherds and flocks of a wealthy man Nabal, and they expected something in return. Rather than honoring David, the man insulted him, so David set out to destroy the man’s estate. Nabal’s wife Abigail intervened to take on her husband’s shame and give David honor. This is in 1 Samuel 25, and let’s pick it up at verse 23. “When Abigail saw David, she quickly got off her donkey and bowed down before David with her face to the ground. She fell at his feet and said: ‘My lord let the blame be on me alone. Please let your servant speak to you; hear what your servant has to say. May my lord pay no attention to that wicked man Nabal. He is just like his name — his name is Fool.'”

⬤Brian: So Nabal is trying to honor himself by shaming David, and David, being insulted, being shamed by Nabal, is going to regain his honor by taking Nabal out, and saying this is what happens to people who try to shame me — to shame him essentially. That’s a threat to Nabal’s whole household. Thankfully Nabal’s wise wife Abigail intervenes and does restore David’s honor coming before him, and she recognizes that he’s the future king and deserves honor.

⬤Marcia: Alright so we can see that the ancient Israelite’s culture in the Older Testament functioned within this honor/shame framework, but what about the New Testament?

⬤Brian: We can definitely see that in Jesus’ interactions with other people, particularly the religious leaders that he’s interacting with. We especially see it when he’s doing it with the Sadducees. So there’s a particular passage in Matthew 22 where they come to him with a test; they’re trying to trap him. And by trapping him and showing Jesus is a fool, he doesn’t know what he’s talking about, they’re going to bring shame on him; they’re going to discredit him. So, they bring this challenge: there’s a story about this woman and she was married to all these men, and one died then she remarried, and the next, etc. to seven men, and finally she died. And so they say at the resurrection whose wife will she be? Because they don’t believe in the resurrection, and they’re trying to show it’s just silly to believe in this. Well, Jesus then turns it around and gives a wise answer.

⬤Marcia: Now, Jesus wouldn’t shame them would he?

⬤Brian: Actually he does! And if you look at the end of this passage, he “answers them, ‘You are wrong because you know neither the Scriptures nor the power of God.'” And think, you’re telling the religious leaders, the people who are the experts in the Scriptures: “You don’t know the Scriptures!” Imagine just telling any expert in their field that they don’t really understand their field at all! That’s a big insult to anyone, even if depending on how you word it, that’s an insult! So I mean Jesus is not above working within their cultural system. He is a part of it. And as a result, this really, through not just this, but multiple things that they’re doing, he stops this game that they’re playing. Because he’s turning the tables: they’re trying to shame him, and instead, it’s coming back on them, and they are being shamed. So at the end of the chapter it says that: no one would answer him and “from that day no one dared to ask him any more questions.” They were done!

⬤Marcia: Sounds like they’re afraid; they don’t want to lose any more honor!

⬤Brian: Exactly!

⬤Marcia: So did the Sadducees do anything to try to regain their honor?

⬤Brian: They did, and they had to try a completely different tactic. This is where they come and say: let’s kill him. And it’s not just killing him, but how: they have him crucified. Crucifixion was one of the most shameful things someone could go through.

⬤Marcia: But does the Bible actually use that term? Does it say Jesus was “shamed”?

⬤Brian: Actually it does. If you look in Hebrews chapter 12, it talks about Jesus going to the cross, he “endured the cross, despising the shame” (the shame of the cross). And what’s the result? He’s “seated at the right hand of the throne of God.” So Jesus willingly became shamed, publicly shamed in front of everyone on the cross, in this terrible way. But what was the end result? With his resurrection and ascension, he regained even more honor in the sight particularly of the Father, and is then seated at the right hand of the Father.

⬤Marcia: This is confusing because we talk about Jesus taking our sin on the cross, and that frees us from guilt. And we talk about the Holy Spirit working within us to convict us of this sin, so that we would feel guilty, and we would repent.

⬤Brian: Yeah and I wouldn’t say that’s inaccurate. But that’s not the way that they would necessarily see it. And God can work in any system, not just ours; for him, this is a cross-cultural thing. The Spirit can both do an inner conviction of guilt but can also have an external conviction that’s addressed with shame.

⬤Marcia: So how does the message of the Gospel fit into these two opposite ways that you can view behavior?

⬤Brian: Well, think about from a western mind perspective: what do we say?

⬤Marcia: We say that God made humans, and initially they were innocent; they were made in God’s image (Adam and Eve). And then there was the fall, and every person since then has sinned, so we’re all guilty before God. And so Jesus comes, and he is innocent (he is sinless), so he takes our guilt upon the cross.

⬤Brian: And that’s a beautiful way. But think about it from an honor/shame framework: God had created the world good with honor. The people could be in God’s presence; it specifically says that Adam and Eve felt no shame before the fall. And then they experienced the fall, which brought shame on them, and they were driven away from God, away from community with God. And then we say Jesus came, and what does he do? He restores our honor, so we can be in the community with God by taking on our shame. Jesus humbled himself, allowing himself to be shamed, so that he could actually gain an even more honorable status for himself, and especially then for us, as he was then restored.

⬤Marcia: Let’s look at a couple of more verses in the New Testament on this topic.

⬤Brian: Okay.

⬤Marcia: 1 Peter 2:6: “Behold I’m laying in Zion a stone, a cornerstone chosen and precious, and whoever believes in him will not be put to shame. And 2 Thessalonians 1:11, “To this end we always pray for you that our God may make you worthy (have honor) of his calling.”

⬤Brian: And this sounds kind of individualistic, but the “whoever” (while singular): you could you could say for an individual, but you could also say for a family or a village or or a nation in that, or it could be a singular group as well. And likewise, when it says “always pray for you” and “make you worthy”, the “you’s” there are plural like we’ve seen in other places. So, pray for all of you; all of you communally are worthy.

⬤Marcia: So sin affects both individuals and communities, and the sin of an individual can affect the community. So forgiving and restoring an individual can also help the community. We often think about praying for repentance for our own personal sins, but we also need to pray prayers of repentance for the community that we’re part of.

⬤Brian: Right. We hope that today’s session has helped you better understand this honor/shame mindset. So be on the lookout as you read through your Bible, where might honor/shame be actually impacting the choices people make, the actions that they take.

⬤Marcia: It’s another reminder that the Bible was written from a communal standpoint, and we’re part of a family of faith. So maybe today you have a greater appreciation of Jesus taking away our shame, and what that means to both individuals and communities.

⬤Brian: You can continue the conversation at BridgesToTheBible.com, where you can download the episode guide. It’s got notes; it’s got discussion questions. We encourage you to look at the discussion questions because there are some more passages you can look at on honor and shame. And be great if you could actually do it in a group. Coming up next time, we’re going to look at names and naming in the Bible. Until then, SHALOM!

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